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Jamie Zawinski Switches to Mac OS X

CmdrTaco posted more than 9 years ago | from the don't-worry-jamie-we-won't-post-it dept.

OS X 1074

iskander writes "After a disappointing experience with sound, Jamie Zawinski has finally given up on desktop Linux and switched to Mac OS X. The future of apps like xscreensaver and Gronk is now ``highly ambiguous''. He has already ditched a free/open platform before, but he seems a lot angrier this time. Indeed, twisted by the Dark Side of the Source, young Zawinski has become."

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Attention.. (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794392)

China: Sack of rice, just fallen...

Who the hell is Jamie Zawinski (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794393)

and why should i care what OS he is running ?

maybe i should submit a story about what OS my neighbour runs, or perhaps his brother and wife

Re:Who the hell is Jamie Zawinski (0)

Lord Apathy (584315) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794441)

I second this. So fucking what? Does anyone want a list of OS I'm running?

Re:Who the hell is Jamie Zawinski (5, Informative)

prodangle (552537) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794500)

http://www.jwz.org/hacks/ [jwz.org]

"Back before you had heard of Netscape, I was responsible for the Unix versions of Netscape Navigator through release 1.1."

"Before Netscape, I was primarily to blame for Lucid Emacs"

"...I was one of the folks who created and ran the Mozilla Organization during the first year of its life"

"But now I've taken my leave of that whole sick, navel-gazing mess we called the software industry. Now I'm in a more honest line of work: now I sell beer."

In other news (1)

essreenim (647659) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794446)

..the artist formerly known as Essreenim now plays Duke Nukem Forever on GNU herd...

Hey! (0)

rbochan (827946) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794510)

I am your neighbor's brother, you insenstive clod!

Re:Who the hell is Jamie Zawinski (4, Funny)

PsychicX (866028) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794600)

According to the link on his name, he's a contributor to XEmacs and Moz.

An XEmacs contributor switches to a more useful system. I love the irony.

I don't get it. (1, Insightful)

WebHostingGuy (825421) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794397)

Okay, he has a preference. Why is this important? I use a lot of different OS for different purposes.

Re:I don't get it. (2, Interesting)

JanneM (7445) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794407)

Okay, he has a preference. Why is this important?

Desktop developers can finally integrate xscreensaver into the Freedesktop framework without pissing him off?

Re:I don't get it. (1, Informative)

DanteLysin (829006) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794427)

Hardly news worthy.

Too bad we can't mod the article submission "overrated".

Re:I don't get it. (1)

kfg (145172) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794530)

Okay, he has a preference. Why is this important?

Well, it could be important if the "story" linked to were a good and original critical analysis of the critical weaknesses that lead to the preferences.

Instead there was nothing to see. I mean nothing. There wasn't even the usual page or two of meaningless blather. At least Jamie won't have to worry much about his bandwidth use skyrocketing over this.

The whole story is the headline, and the headline is uninteresting.

KFG

mac sux (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794399)

frosty cold piss yall
-MikeTROLL screwed your mom!-

From TFA (5, Funny)

byolinux (535260) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794400)

Dear Slashdot: please don't post about this. Screw you guys.

D'oh!

Re:From TFA (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794431)

I have ALSA problems, too. Please don't /. me. Thx.

Re:From TFA (3, Funny)

RonnyJ (651856) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794536)

See, reverse-psychology does work!

Re:From TFA (3, Funny)

Rahga (13479) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794591)

Nah, it's just more proof that even /. editors don't read the articles.

And people wonder why there are so many reposts....

And they did it anyway... (-1, Redundant)

DanTilkin (129681) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794406)

To quote Jamie in the linked post:

Dear Slashdot: please don't post about this. Screw you guys.

Re:And they did it anyway... (1)

CausticPuppy (82139) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794439)

I suppose that explains CmdrTaco's subtitle "from the don't-worry-jamie-we-won't-post-it dept."

From his site: (0, Redundant)

DogcowX (888899) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794408)

Dear Slashdot: please don't post about this. Screw you guys.

Mwah ha ha ha ha haaaa!

new flash... (4, Insightful)

rednip (186217) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794413)

JWZ disallusioned, posts comment in blog... news at 11.

I hate to be a jerk, I loved all his negitive comments about Netscape/ Mozilla, and whatever else he works on, but it got old like 6 years ago.

What is this article doing on Slashdot? (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794415)

So someone is switching to OS-X? So what?? And this made the frontpage news? May I ask why? Is it happening so rarely that when one person makes the switch to OS-X it is a front page news?

MOD PARENT UP! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794463)

Mod parent up. This article is ridiculous! For the sake of Slashdot's credibility we shouldn't be seeing articles like this.

Losing faith (1)

October_30th (531777) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794493)

For the sake of Slashdot's credibility we shouldn't be seeing articles like this.

Yes! And don't forget about those whose faith in the power of the open source is still weak. They might begin to falter in their faith if they see open source icon like Jamie openly discussing his loss of faith and subsequent defection to a non-free camp in public.

Re:What is this article doing on Slashdot? (2, Insightful)

Waffle Iron (339739) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794526)

And this made the frontpage news? May I ask why?

Well, at least it's not another report about the latest status of the 3 suspects in Aruba.

Re:What is this article doing on Slashdot? (1)

shish (588640) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794561)

So what??

So linux no longer has an active xscreensaver maintainer

Re:What is this article doing on Slashdot? (2, Funny)

generic-man (33649) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794590)

It's open source, right? That means that anyone could be an xscreensaver maintainer! Everyone can modify the code and the software will be updated forever and ever!

If you need me, I'll be in my ivory tower.

Motivation? (2, Interesting)

mistersooreams (811324) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794416)

This seems to me more like a desperate cry for attention in which Zawinski says he is switching platform in the hope that the Linux mob will cry "Don't leave us Jamie!" and he can then return in a blaze of glory. I really appreciate everything that he has done for OSS, and I hope others do too, but I can't condone something like this. Mod me troll you like, but he seems frighteningly cynical.

Re:Motivation? (0)

Homology (639438) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794449)

This seems to me more like a desperate cry for attention in which Zawinski says he is switching platform in the hope that the Linux mob will cry "Don't leave us Jamie!" and he can then return in a blaze of glory.

Who is this fellow anyway? I've never heard about him before, so why should I care what some random blogger is writing?

Re:Motivation? (3, Interesting)

cowbutt (21077) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794517)

Who is this fellow anyway? I've never heard about him before, so why should I care what some random blogger is writing?

jwz is responsible for many significant *NIX applications [jwz.org] .

Re:Motivation? (1)

shish (588640) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794545)

RTFSummary... He's the maintainer of xscreensaver, along with a bunch of other less used (but still cool) linux apps

Bullshit (5, Informative)

bobbis.u (703273) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794489)

Maybe he just got tired of fucking around with Linux. He got bored of having to trawl through "help" documents, fiddlying with config files and generally wasting time to achieve a second best result. He probably decided his time was worth the cost of buying a professional operating system that works. OK, so maybe he can't now reconfigure the colour of the drop shadow on the mouse pointer, but he clearly doesn't care about that.

Also, he doesn't really care what the Linux crowd thinks, which is why he posted the remark about Slashdot.

Re:Bullshit (3, Insightful)

daviddennis (10926) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794598)

He actually followed a pretty similar path to me.

Both of us have a significant amount of experience with SGI workstations. SGI, like Apple today, was a Unix that "just works". It had pretty fonts and a very nice designer look and feel. It was also elegant and a snap to administrate.

I, like JWZ, also used Linux workstations. But they were clunky compared to SGI and I always came back to the better design and more attractive display SGI had.

I also had a MacOS computer, which I used for video editing and running commercial software such as Photoshop. I liked it a lot, but was wedded to emacs for text editing and SGI or Linux for web serving. So as a result I needed to have two computers on my desk, a Mac for graphics and a SGI for Unix stuff.

Then MacOS X came out. It was a lot like SGI - it was like a designer Unix, with even more slickness. As a result, I gradually switched away from SGI, especially when it became clear that SGI was not updating their GUI to be competitive with what Apple has. I shed a tear for SGI, because their stuff was the best at the time. I wish they'd been able to make a more elegant transition to the world of cheaper computers.

For me, MacOS X truly combines the best of the open source and proprietary worlds. I can use a slick and stable GUI, running all the slickest proprietary applications such as Final Cut Pro and Photoshop. On the same machine I can also run all the open source web software I could ever want. And I can even copy that software and have it run fine on a Linux server without missing a beat.

So I know exactly where JWZ's coming from, and it's interesting that we followed such a similar path. I joined Apple before he did probably mainly due to my need for proprietary software like Final Cut and Photoshop.

I can say from my own experience that I've never been happier with my computing environment than I am now. We'll see how the more cynical JWZ does. No doubt he'll find much to hate and much to love.

D

Re:Motivation? (1)

renoX (11677) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794563)

What's make you think this is "ploy"?

You know, he is not the only one who rejected Linux, I did too..
Too much of a pain to use Linux at home, so I switched to WinXP, amusingly at work we've gone from Solaris to Linux so I'm still using Linux, but what I see at work doesn't particulary push me to use Linux again at home: the desktop (KDE on RHE3) feels *slow* on a 3GHz P4 with 2GB of RAM!!

While I like using Linux for servers, for desktop I don't think it is very good..

Re:Motivation? (1)

Seumas (6865) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794580)

Yeah, it's like I was saying with that bitch up and left me. It wasn't that I was such a bad guy - I was all like "Clearly I'm too good for you, bitch! So that why you be leavin, huh?!"

And yeah, it's clearly such a cry for attention, what with him posting it all over the... er... uh... just his personal blog.

Mac OSX just doesn't "feel" right to me. And I don't like all the trouble that comes with complex/non-standard linux desktop setups. I keep linux for my servers and find other solutions for my desktops. And I decided not to go the OSX rout and sold my 17" Powerbook after only a few months. It was a nice little tool, but just.... didn't feel good.

Personally, I'm kind of disgusted with people's responses here.

Re:Motivation? (1)

tyler@mango.net.nz (129548) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794632)


I don't think it's cynical as much as truthful. I read this and nodded my head in agreement, I've tried lixux every year for the past 3 or 4 years, and have found it more and more usable - but the basic stuff STILL DOES NOT WORK.

Example - squid proxy can now log users on via active directory, but cannot LOG this information - it logs all the other fields, but puts unknown when listing username, even through it logged them on!

The basics for home and corporate users is still sorely missing in Linux and OSS projects.

Congratulations, Jamie. (4, Funny)

croddy (659025) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794418)

You got your LiveJournal linked on the front page of Slashdot. Now get your butt upstairs, Mom needs help with the dishes!

Jamie's mom is way cool! (1)

SimHacker (180785) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794595)

So yea, he should get his ass upstairs and help her with the dishes.

-Don

Is anyone else sick of this? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794422)

Is anyone sick of articles glorifying individuals who swap operating systems? This has got to be the most mundane non-news out there.

From JWZ's LiveJournal post... (-1, Redundant)

frantzdb (22281) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794428)


Dear Slashdot: please don't post about this. Screw you guys.


Have you no sense of decency, Slashdot, at long lat?

The reason he switched.. (3, Funny)

wfberg (24378) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794436)

.. it DIDN'T go "beep beep beep".

Sounds familiar (5, Insightful)

October_30th (531777) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794444)

I gave up and went to Mac. I still have a Linux desktop, but I am sick, sick, sick to death of having to tweak every last little friggin' thing.

I also gave up and went for a Mac for exactly the same reason. It's unacceptable that in 2005 a Linux distribution (FC3, in my case) doesn't recognize a three-button+wheel USB mouse out-of-box or that setting up a TV card requires you to edit some config-files by hand.

Re:Sounds familiar (0, Troll)

l3v1 (787564) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794538)

three-button+wheel USB mouse out-of-box or that setting up a TV card requires you to edit some config-files by hand

Mmkay, just one quick showcase. My logitech usb mouse has a windows driver, which needs restart when installed, then I tweak its settings. My pinnacle tv card needs a windows driver installed, which also needs a restart to work. In linux my mouse works without any fuss, my tv card also works great with the bttv and I only need to seelect the tuner type in a config file. Then I'm good to go. How is the latter more hard than the first ? Oh, I know, it needs you to know what you're doing, and that usually needs some brainwork.

Re:Sounds familiar (5, Insightful)

generic-man (33649) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794613)

If I buy a TV tuner card, I don't want to examine the model numbers of all the chips on it just so I can use it to watch TV. I want to insert it into my computer, toss in a CD, reboot, and then watch American Idol until my brain falls out.

Re:Sounds familiar (5, Insightful)

October_30th (531777) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794617)

My logitech usb mouse has a windows driver

I don't quite understand why you're using Windows as a reference, when I was clearly talking about Mac. I plugged the mouse in and it just worked.

Oh, I know, it needs you to know what you're doing, and that usually needs some brainwork.

Ah yes, the tired old "If Linux is not good enough for you, it's because you're not good enough for Linux" argument. Ten years ago I used to spout that elitist bullshit, too.

I've lost the count of how many Linux computers I've built. I've set up and maintained Sun and DEC Alpha boxes (running both DEC Unix and Linux) and, quite frankly, I feel like I've done my share of tweaking. Now, all I want is a desktop computer that works for me -- not vice versa -- and Linux just doesn't cut it.

Re:Sounds familiar (1)

ninja_assault_kitten (883141) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794548)

Yeah, Linux may be open, but it still pretty much sucks from a usability standpoint. Sure, it's come a hell of a long way in the last 10 days, but it's moving too slowly and losing ground day after day.

Unless something significant changes, the only place I see Linux as having real potential for growth is with embedded systems that don't require any direct OS interaction and run on perdictable hardware platforms.

Fix Setup! (1, Insightful)

pjh3000 (583652) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794447)

If some individuals would spend the time they do hunting down negative comments about Linux, to actually fix Linux, you wouldn't have to worry about people exposing how difficult Linux is for the average user. I'm all for bringing Linux to the mainstream and replacing Windows as the dominant OS, but that just won't happen until the average person can install their video games without calling tech support.

Re:Fix Setup! (1)

anthony_dipierro (543308) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794620)

If some individuals would spend the time they do hunting down negative comments about Linux, to actually fix Linux, you wouldn't have to worry about people exposing how difficult Linux is for the average user.

Part of the problem is that it isn't well publicized just *how* to go about fixing Linux. I used to be a kernel programmer for Hewlett Packard, and when I came to work I was surrounded by lots of smart people who knew a lot about what they were doing. I had dozens of various HP boxes set up with serial consoles and just waiting for me to load up a test kernel. I had fairly good documentation, a decent bug tracking system, and a whole suite of functional and reliability tests to run.

Give me just half that kind of support and I'd gladly spend a bit of my spare time hacking Linux. But that's not how it works. Instead it seems 99% of the work is just figuring out how to get started.

Anyway, I'm probably wasting my breath, but if an experienced Linux kernel programmer wants to help me get started, leave a message here with some way I can get in contact with you.

Slashdot: News for Nerds. Stuff. (1)

prodangle (552537) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794451)

"Dear Slashdot: please don't post about this. Screw you guys."

Slashdot lowers itself to new depths. Taco: you could've left this one.

Re:Slashdot: News for Nerds. Stuff. (1)

bobbis.u (703273) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794508)

Taco: you could've left this one.

Did you really think that Taco (or any of the other editors) actually bother to read the articles?

Re:Slashdot: News for Nerds. Stuff. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794558)

Actually, I think they did... "from the don't-worry-jamie-we-won't-post-it dept."

Re:Slashdot: News for Nerds. Stuff. (1)

ctid (449118) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794602)

This is the internet. If you put a message up on your journal, surely it's fair game to write about it?

I Find Jamie's Lack of Faith Disturbing (2, Funny)

TooMuchEspressoGuy (763203) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794453)

C'mon... a sound problem is enough to make someone abandon an entire OS? Heck, if that were true, I would have abandoned my Windows box years ago.

Farewell, O ye of little faith.

He is the author of Gronk, an MP3 player (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794479)

I'm fed up with the primative state of Linux sound, too.

Re:I Find Jamie's Lack of Faith Disturbing (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794507)

let me see, the majority of the output of a modern operating system are... video, sound and maybe printing

i'd say yes its a major issue

Re:I Find Jamie's Lack of Faith Disturbing (3, Interesting)

Al Dimond (792444) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794569)

Certainly that's the case for a modern desktop operating system.

To be honest, I'm still waiting for a feature from BeOS to hit the "modern desktop operating system" scene: volume bars in the mixer for each different program that's using sound. So if I want to listen to music and play a game with obnoxious sound that can't be disabled (this happens with Java and Flash games mostly), I don't have to listen to the obnoxious sound.

I could probably create a user account, not put it in the "sound" group, and run all such games under that user, and it wouldn't have permission to access the sound device...

Re:I Find Jamie's Lack of Faith Disturbing (1)

l3v1 (787564) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794572)

Heck, if that were true, I would have abandoned my Windows box years ago.

Oh so true. My good old terratec dmx xfire sound card's windows drivers always had some problems, since the day I bought it. Also, I had to abandon the default drivers of my tuner, but thank god a GPL'd bttv wdm driver for windows does the job perfectly. At my workplace I have a usb hp printer+fax machine hooked up to my machine and shared to the rest, which'd driver is so suckingly bad that it causes BSOD every time it's switched on/off. I'm sure many people could tell even wierder stories.

What a dick (1)

maelstrom (638) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794460)

Not JWZ, CmdrTaco for posting this.

From the blog of George W Bush (5, Funny)

p3d0 (42270) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794483)

I have decided I'm going to go ahead and invade Cyria.

Dear CNN: please don't report this. Screw you guys.

I feel a disturbance, as if a Friends List on LJ.. (1)

farrellj (563) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794461)

Was suddenly pruned...

Come on, JWZ asked the people not to run to Slashdot about it, kindly honour his privacy request.

ttyl
Farrell

You know that's the only reason they ran it. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794498)

Because he asked them not to, you see! Oh blippety bloopity.

He put it on the internet. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794505)

If he didn't want people to know, that seems like an odd way to go about it.

Re:He put it on the internet. (1)

farrellj (563) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794623)

True, but LJ is about community, something we used to have here on Slashdot...

ttyl
Farrell

I'm writing to share a tragic little story (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794470)

I have a Linux PC that I used to use for my source code editing. One night, I was writing some code on it, when all of a sudden it went berserk, the screen started flashing, and the whole subroutine just disappeared. All of it. And it was a good screensaver! And it didn't even go beep beep beep because I couldn't get the sound card driver working. I had to cram and rewrite it really quickly. Needless to say, my rushed screensaver wasn't nearly as good, and I blame that PC for that.

I'm happy to report I now run Apple OSX. It's a lot nicer to work on than my Linux PC was, it hasn't let me down once, and my grades have all been really good.

Thanks, Apple.

Jamie Zawinski

A Tad Cranky (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794473)

Mmm...we care about this guy, why? He sounds like a whiney brat (and I'm not even saying that 'cause of his views on Linux - I'm just saying it 'cause it's friggin' true).

Grow up, baby.

telling (5, Insightful)

bwy (726112) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794475)

I think it is pretty telling that someone who has a lot of technical expertise has the same problems that a lot of us have had with desktop Linux. The problem is real, folks.

If Linux on the desktop is to survive, I really think there needs to be a major coordinated effort to get lots of things in line. Maybe some type of consortium that would facilitate dialog between different groups and/or state a common direction. It is really hard to build a solid desktop OS when you've got thousands of developers operating independently or in small groups. You might get a few good solid apps, but the OS itself is going to be a patchworked hodge-podge.

Re:telling (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794518)

I could care less if you, Jamie, or your grandmother run linux. Really.

Re:telling (1)

mr. marbles (19251) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794529)

Seriously we know that while Linux has come a long way there's still a long way to go. Some distro, company, or group is gonna have to take Linux and do what Apple did for bsd, except leave the contributions open. This should be a signal to Desktop oriented projects like Gnome and KDE, the Desktop experience might be a lot better but it's still not as good as buying a Mac and be able to expect everything to just work.

Re:telling (1)

maelstrom (638) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794550)

How is this insightful?

Look up the following:

The OS itself (1)

glrotate (300695) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794610)

Tell us bwy, what problems do you have with the Linux kernel?

You would too if... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794477)

... you knew where to get the .torrent. :P

Obnoxious screensaver (4, Funny)

art6217 (757847) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794481)

Perhaps it is because the Mac OS X screensaver does not have the obnoxious features like:

1. Short timeout for writing passwords, what may make it difficult for some people to unlock the screen at all.

2. Stupid, delaying messages after entering the wrong password, as if the security delay by the authorization system was not enough.

3. Ugly, ugly, *ugly* logo.

4. Small, non-antialiased fonts in the password dialog, as if the screen space was so scarce when all other windows are hidden anyway.

;)

Re:Obnoxious screensaver (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794601)

1. This is adjustable in the ".xscreensaverrc" file by setting the parameter "passwdTimeout". However, you shouldn't make it too long because the X server is grabbed during that time period.

2. As far as I can tell, it *is* the security delay, not a delay specific to xscreesasver. Timing it on my computer, the delay is the same as if I entered an incorrect password at the bash login.

3. Check out the newest versions, the logo finally entered the 21st century. Debian sarge has the nice logo.

4. This is a problem with your distro. The fonts are large (actually, a little bigger then I want) and readable on my debian install on 1600x1200. Unfortunately, not anti-aliased because they do not depend upon any widgetset libraries to prevent security holes in them applying to the password dialog. Not only that, this is also modifiable in the config file.

Read the man page, dude! ;)

(Or, you could just use KDE and its screensaver applet, which I think has much nicer password and config dialogs...)

Complete and utter apathy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794486)

Who the fuck is Jamie Sawinski?
Why the fuck do we care?

1. Don't know.
2. Don't care.

Ok (1)

savage1r (856578) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794487)

So who is this guy and why should I care?

Funniest post on livejournal: (2, Funny)

haggar (72771) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794491)


Dear Slashdot: please don't post about this. Screw you guys.

You'll be lucky. This will be posted to Slashdot within twelve hours. And then again twelve hours after that.

Re:Funniest post on livejournal: (1)

Paul Crowley (837) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794528)

Thank you! *bows*

Re:Funniest post on livejournal: (1)

King Babar (19862) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794567)

Paul Crowley (837) writes:
Thank you! *bows*

Slashdot user 837? So who should be bowing to whom here?

Re:Funniest post on livejournal: (1)

haggar (72771) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794616)

ciphergoth?

Dark Side (5, Insightful)

Ed Almos (584864) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794492)

No, he has NOT been twisted by the dark side, he has just been pissed off for the last time by Linux software which does not do the job.

We have a printer system that was developed for line printers and never matured.

We have a sound system that works most (but not all) of the time if you are lucky.

We have power management issues on laptops which Microsoft fixed in 1995.

And finally

I have a laptop running Red Hat 9 because Fedora 1, Fedora 2, Fedora 3 and SuSE 9.x all have so many major problems with their basic installation that the machine is unusable. My next laptop will be an Apple machine.

Instead of adding more features I for one would be grateful if the Linux software developers fixed existing software. Bug hunting is not sexy but it might avoid more incidents like this.

Ed Almos
Budapest, Hungary

Re:Dark Side (2)

maelstrom (638) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794570)

"We have a printer system that was developed for line printers and never matured."

Are you referring to Cups?

"We have a sound system that works most (but not all) of the time if you are lucky."

How is this different from OSX or Windows?

"We have power management issues on laptops which Microsoft fixed in 1995."

Agreed, plus suspend is a PITA!

Macs Intel and Switching (1, Insightful)

eSavior (767078) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794497)

I've considered ditching my linux desktop for a mac box. Though I am not important or anything so me moving platforms would be moot. I don't have as much time to tinker as I used to, and these days I really want something that just works. And thats really what the mac desktop promises isnt it? It just works. But now that they are switching platforms, the idea of making the switch now seems like a bad idea. I like to keep machines way longer than I should, I still have a pentium 1 mmx running gentoo.. I fear that if I get a ppc mac that 6 years down the road I wont be able to find working applications for it.

bleh oh well. I guess I will consider switching again after they make the move to intel.

Re:Macs Intel and Switching (1)

JoshDanziger (878933) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794586)

And thats really what the mac desktop promises isnt it? It just works.

You can say that things on a Mac just work, but I also think that you'll find it much easier to write sound drivers if there is only one sound card on the market.

If every Linux programmer agreed to use the exact same hardware, we'd have a bulletproof distro. The problem is that the different hardware combinations possible on the x86 architecture make it all but impossible to accomodate everyone.

-Josh

JWZ is a fucking Troll (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794502)

Fuck him! He is a known Troll in our GNOME community. He hasn't contributed anything to the Open Source community and yet has nerves to criticise our work. Maybe he starts coding something on his own then he will know how hard it is to get something like GNOME right.

too bad, hopefully temporary (1)

anthony_dipierro (543308) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794504)

That's really too bad. Jamie is a smart guy, presumably has a good deal of money, and has a bit of a pulpit (as evidenced by this Slashdot article). I really wish he had taken the "fix it" approach rather than switch. That said, I can understand the frustration, personally I've had enough trouble with Linux that I'm forced to use Windows for my main operating system. But my solution is meant to be temporary, and hopefully JWZ's is too. It takes a long time to build an operating system, especially when you rely mainly on people working for free.

Dear Slashdot: please don't post about this. Screw you guys.

LOL.

People come, and people go. (1)

CyricZ (887944) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794515)

People come, and people go. He's made his contributions, but his time in the spotlight is now up. Younger people, such as those behind the Firefox project, have taken the limelight. Soon enough we'll be hearing about how they've switched OSes, and the cycle of open source celebrity popularity will continue.

Re:People come, and people go. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794614)

Don't hold your breath waiting to hear about a big OS switch. A couple of the main Firefox developers are already on Mac OS X, and a lot of the UI development stuff happens on Windows (which is the platform that most Firefox users are on)

Desktop Linux (1)

MuMart (537836) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794516)

I have had similar problems with sound on linux. The ICE1712 driver for my Terratec DMX 6Fire is pretty flakey at times, and the various options you get for the mixer are pretty horrible (The volume controls are "Dac" and "Dac1" for the left and right channels, and they don't tie together as a stereo pair).

I also wish I could unmount a CDROM by pressing the eject button.

I think the main culprit for little usability problems like this is lack of quality control by the distribution makers. Unfortunately these difficulties don't matter much to the large scale business installations they are targetting.

Still, this is definitely something that could be improved.

Well.. the gnome people are trying to do this (1, Insightful)

Adult film producer (866485) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794533)

But all they get is grief everytime they make a change to make life easier for people. ie. Spatial nautilus one of those ideas that will improve life for the people using gnome, but 99% of linux blowhards reject the new paradigm saying it's just not right, they don't even try it, just bitch & moan until they figure out how to switch it back... But if they're going to keep their old bad habits then stop bitching about people trying to improve the desktop.

Here's the problem with sound on Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794549)

ALSA works great *if* you have a sound card that does hardware mixing. If you look at the ALSA soundcard matrix (search Google), all cards that have a "(3)" marked in the Notes column have ALSA support for hardware mixing. This means that you can send sound from multiple sources to the card, and the chip on the card can mix them into the combined output).

Most of your low-end cards and almost all mobo-integrated sound chips do *not* support hardware mixing. They can only accept one sound source at a time. This means the software (OS+apps) must do the mixing ahead of time. If you remember the uproar about "winmodems" a few years ago, this is roughly the same thing -- sound card manufacturers are saving a few bucks by not putting hardware mixing on the card.

This is what happened to JWZ. He's got a chip that doesn't support hardware mixing, and so more than one app won't make noise at the same time. I'm in the exact same position. I used to have a sound card that supported hardware mixing, but then I upgraded to a machine with mobo sound that doesn't have hardware mixing. And it is truly a total PAIN-IN-THE-ASS to get it working in software. So much so that it is 100 times easier to just go buy a card that supports hardware mixing than to fight with ALSA and all the apps.

The real problem is that ASLA for some bizarre reason cannot just intercept all calls to the sound card, mix them, and send the combined output to the sound card. It *SHOULD* be able to handle this transparently, but it doesn't. In addition to fiddling with a nasty alsa config file (involves manually setting up a software mixer), you have to configure * every * freaking * app * on the system, one by one, to send sound to the mixer instead of just sending sound to /dev/sound. And that's *if* the software even supports such a thing. A lot of the older stuff doesn't let you do this, so you end up having to start these old apps from the command line with a prefix like "dmixapp mpg123" (I forget the exact syntax -- there are 100 tutorials on the web if you really want to know).

What's really painful is that that you go and look at Windows, and it handles this situation very gracefully. Somehow it just knows when you have a card installed that does not support hardware mixing, and it doesn't make you go and reconfigure all of your apps one-by-one to be able to play multiple sounds at once.

It is one of life's great mysteries why on earth you can't just tell ALSA in one place "do software mixing", and have it transparently intercepts all sound that would otherwise be routed to the card. Even native ALSA apps have to be explicitly told to use the software mixer. I agree with JWZ that this is really, really, really user-unfriendly and stupid. (However, I'm not switching to OSX over it.)

good riddance (1)

cahiha (873942) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794554)

Zawinski's flames against the X11 window system have not helped the platform. Let him live with XCode, Objective-C, and Quartz for a while, and let the Macintosh community put up with him.

Re:good riddance (1)

SimHacker (180785) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794618)

>Zawinski's flames against the X11 window system have not helped the platform.

Don't you mean X-Windows? Get it right.

-Don

Why do people care!!! (1)

indian_mogul (758338) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794566)

I still don't understand if a lone soul switches from Linux to Mac OS X, why is there so much fuzz and buzz and hissing and screaming. Who cares what you run under your hood? If u do not like linux, it's not because it's bad but because u want it to look bad. Many cards are not supported in linux becasue manufactures don't open up the specs; Is that the fault of Linux? So, stop whinning and simply pass into oblivion.

Funny thing... (5, Interesting)

ATMosby (746034) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794575)

Some of the same reasons that I'm switching away from Linux to OSX. Don't have the time to fight those battles anymore. *Don't* want to fight those battles anymore

Huh?! (0, Troll)

flokemon (578389) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794596)

We've had blogs, now *Livejournal* ?!
Can Slashdot get any lower than this?

I switched to synthetic (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794597)

It seemed logical to me. Synthetic oil has many advantages over dino oil. If you shop around, some retail outlets have store brand full synthetic which averages about $3 more for a 5qt bottle ($12 for 5 qt bottle). I've thought about using the synthetic blends but no one has any idea what % of each type of oil makes up the mix. I assume 1% synthetic could be considered a blend as well and the oil companies make no effort to make the exact %s known either. They consider this a trade secret, I consider it a potential scam. I had all of this on my blog but /. did not pick up on it.

Sounds like a hardware problem to me... (-1)

strredwolf (532) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794611)

This is what I posted to his LiveJournal.

Hard to hear you say that (I heard this on Slashdot, alas). I heard you had problems with sound cards in Linux. However, I do belive you may have the same problems with MacOS X -- you can't play two sounds at once.

Why? Most sound cards don't support it in the hardware. Ether you need a sucky ALSA plugin (dmix), sucky sound servers (ESD/ARTS/JACK), or... a sound card which has a hardware mixer and natively supports it.

I still have an old Creative Audio PCI card, an es1371 based card. It had two sound ports (dsp0 and dsp1). I would slap ESD/ARTS/whatever on dsp1 and let XMMS/VMWare/whatever have dsp0. I now have a Soundblaster Live! card, which under ALSA has only one sound port that can be opened fifty ways to San Diego at the same time, and it doesn't even jam.

Yes, Soundblaster Live. It just works.

I'd still keep the Mac. I'd slap Linux PPC on it and run MacOnLinux to keep MacOS X on it.

Hear that? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12794619)

It is the sound of the world's smallest violin playing the world's saddest song just for you JWZ you whinny little bitch. Instead of working with the community, you've chosen the path of blame Linux for your problems because obviously you are just a little baby.

Sound (5, Insightful)

ultrabot (200914) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794621)

The posts so for have missed the main point. That is, sound in Linux sucks. It just needs to be fixed.

- arts must die, and it will w/ KDE4

- esd must die

- every program should start using gstreamer

- ALSA must learn to do proper software mixing out of the box.

Imagine my "pleasure" when I inadvertly caused a "beep" to emerge from my terminal window, and as a result had to wait a while (20 seconds? can't remember) before I could start playing a video with sound. Or how I had to do "killall -9 artsd" to start playing video in totem after listening to music on Amarok (which is superior to rhythmbox in most ways).

no wonder (1)

Exter-C (310390) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794624)

Many people that write code like the person in the article just dont get enough support from the open source users.

That's it, I'm switching too! (5, Funny)

bgfay (5362) | more than 9 years ago | (#12794633)

I've had it with these complicated operating systems. I've never gotten my printer to work correctly on Linux, my Mac is just a total pain in the ass and slug, and I spend hours upon hours trying to do the easiest things on Windows.

The hell with all of you. I just installed DOS on my box and all is well.

Slashdot, please don't post this. You guys are jerks and I'm going to tell my mommy about you.
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