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Mad as Hell, Switching to Mac

Zonk posted more than 9 years ago | from the i-want-you-to-go-to-the-window dept.

Security 1262

justAMan writes "Security dude, Winn Schwartau, has posted an article on Network World about switching his company to Macs because he's fed up with the security issues plaguing Windows-based systems. He also offers his view on why Windows is inherently flawed and why it will eventually fail because of those reasons. From the article, 'This is my first column written on a Mac - ever. Maybe I should have done it a long time ago, but I never said I was smart, just obstinate. I was a PC bigot. But now, I've had it. I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore.'"

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Flame on... (3, Funny)

It doesn't come easy (695416) | more than 9 years ago | (#12643948)

Wowzers, every post on this topic is going to be modded flamebait...

Asbestos suits, anyone?

Re:Flame on... (5, Insightful)

Golias (176380) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644037)

You know, I'm a Mac user. I freakin' love Macs. I think Steve Jobs, for all his flaws, is a hero.

That said, I think it's a sad state of affairs that people consider it a news story that some nobody columnist has decided he likes Macs better than Windows. All this cheerleading for "switchers" is really pathetic.

Hey, Windows users: Use whatever you like. I don't give a fuck. If one of you decides that switching to the Mac is a good idea, it really donesn't make my preference of computers any better.

Re:Flame on... (5, Funny)

Golias (176380) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644064)

Hey, Windows users: Use whatever you like. I don't give a fuck. If one of you decides that switching to the Mac is a good idea, it really donesn't make my preference of computers any better. ... and you can tell I'm posting from work using Firefox on a PC, because the built-in spellcheck on my iBook at home would have caught that "donesn't" crap.

Re:Flame on... (2, Interesting)

NoMoreNicksLeft (516230) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644125)

I actually hate Macs. I love the 64bit PPC, and even some of the other hardware. But they're fashion computers. I would never buy a Mac(exceptions: an Xserve if I win the lottery, and vintage macs... love old computers).

I don't like the look of OSX.

But by god, this guy is right, and people need to listen to him. I'm an "anything but windows" person, and ugly as OSX is to me, I bet it's pretty tolerable to most people out there and it definitely qualifies on the "anything but windows"

$500. You can't even claim they cost too much.

PS Woz was the hero.

Re:Flame on... (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644181)

PS Woz was the hero.

We are talking about Macs. They have nothing to do with Steve Wozniak. Not only was he not on the Mac team, he wasn't even part of the company anymore when the Mac was being invented.

Woz is also a hero, but has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

Re:Flame on... (5, Insightful)

telbij (465356) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644185)

Hey, Windows users: Use whatever you like. I don't give a fuck. If one of you decides that switching to the Mac is a good idea, it really donesn't make my preference of computers any better.

Since Mac OS X came out I've been a happy Mac user, but I'd just assume the world stay on Windows (or Linux)... Why? Because the fewer Macs there are the less target they are for virus and exploit writers.

Sure I believe Mac OS X is more secure than Windows (how could it not be), but let's not fool ourselves. Securing something as complex as an operating system is no trivial task. Given the average user's distaste for software update, a critical mass of the all-too-uniform Mac OS X could create an unpleasant security situation. Compare to Linux which (at present) has the diversity to survive any attack.

Flame on... (5, Informative)

Axe (11122) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644120)

It is not funny. It is true. Every time I have mentioned that Windows OS is actually quite functional and stable nowdays that post was moderated down.

I do use a 2003 Server at home and at work and I have yet to have a single virus or malware infection. I do apply patches, run a firewall etc.

Yes, it is possible to set it up such that you can execute remote content automatically and get infected. But it is also trivial, and now it is a default setting to configure it NOT to execute remote content. Since Mac can not run that content anyway - that will not be a loss of functionality compared to a Mac.

P.S. I do like Macs, especially their laptops. If I was back at university doing physics data analysis that would be my platform of choice nowdays instead of Linux. But I definitely do not feel a pressing need to switch from 2003.

"Windows is complex" (5, Insightful)

mzieg (317686) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644131)

Seems to me, complexity itself isn't the problem. All modern operating systems are complex, and have to be in order to handle all the different network protocols, user interfaces, I/O devices, background processes, etc. The issue is how that complexity is managed.

One thing that I've always admired about Apple is that (like Google) they seem to have a corporate culture which heavily encourages new features to be integrated ELEGANTLY into existing frameworks. They really seem to spend time, thought, money, and even passion on finding a "clean" way to do things.

My impression of Microsoft has been rather the opposite: when they've decided to add a new feature, just add a new "required" desktop item; toss it in the Start menu; add a fifteenth tab to the Options dialog; create a bazillionth DOS8CHAR.DLL in the Windows directory; and you're done! The corporate culture seems to encourage slap-dash engineering of a form that would be frankly chucked out at Apple, Google, and other "cultured" companies.

Re:Flame on... (1)

sundog61 (816978) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644132)

It's not news, it's just flamebait. I think somebody wanted a nice little flame war to start today.

YE FIRST POST (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12643956)

HOO RAY

Re:YE FIRST POST (1)

It doesn't come easy (695416) | more than 9 years ago | (#12643986)

There's no such thing as "first post" on Slashdot...the posts are routinely reordered depending on how much pixie dust has infiltrated the Slashdot servers...

*Opens Window* (2, Funny)

suso (153703) | more than 9 years ago | (#12643957)

I'm as mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore.

*Closes Window* (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12643998)

*Closes Window* I'm as mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore.

And we care why? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12643980)

Good for him I guess. If he really wants to deal with that kind of a mess.... be my guest.

Just don't whine and complain later when it doesn't all magically work like the idealized version in your head convinced yourself it was going to.

No doubt! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12643981)

I read this yesterday and thought I was reading about my own experience. This is EXACTLY what I have been screaming about in our organization for 5 years. Finally this year, we went all Mac and now my job as IT director is managable rather than impossible.

Re:No doubt! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644023)

now my job as IT director is managable rather than impossible

Seems like you are doing the actual work in your company as a director. That means either you don't have sys admins and qualified IT people or you are IT director of a 3 employee company.

Uh oh... (5, Funny)

tgd (2822) | more than 9 years ago | (#12643982)

Queue the "why not use Linux on the hardware you already have" brigade! Fire up the klaxons! Bwooop, bwooop, bwooop!

Re:Uh oh... (4, Insightful)

Epistax (544591) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644033)

Well, that's an extremely good question no matter how you try to belittle it. The only valid reason I can think of is the perception that it's safer (not security) and easier to use a Mac, which is likely true to a varing degree depending on implementation.

Re:Uh oh... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644099)

Stop coming up with "valid" reasons for Mac use, or we will have to ask for your Linux Zealot membership pin back.

Re:Uh oh... (4, Insightful)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644138)

The primary reason is that Macs Just Work(TM), which is exactly what this guy is after. He doesn't want to bother with packaging, experimental drivers, non-ability to sleep, and other issues that come with Linux (especially on laptops). Plus, Macs can run a lot of Officially Supported Microsoft software that the industry feels it needs in order to be compatible.

Which brings up an interesting point. Does anyone remember back when Microsoft's bread and butter was BASIC? IMHO, it will be impossible to kill Microsoft even if Windows is supplanted. Microsoft will instead move to being a premier software provider for another platform, and continue to hang around as IBM did after they lost the market.

Meanwhile... (1, Funny)

Otter (3800) | more than 9 years ago | (#12643985)

...I notice that Slashdot has banned itself from the Ask Slashdot RSS feed for downloading too often...

Re:Meanwhile... (1)

REBloomfield (550182) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644014)

This has been confusing me all morning, esp. as I don't use a news reader.....

Glad to see it's not just me...

Re:Meanwhile... (1)

stoney27 (36372) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644049)

Yea and my Apple highlights are band too. I am glad it's not just me.

-S

what is he talking about? (-1, Troll)

P3NIS_CLEAVER (860022) | more than 9 years ago | (#12643987)

I have a 500$ emachine that does everything the he/I wants to do. I run windows update on a regular basis and have never had a problem. What a whiner. What do i care about different bios versions?

Re:what is he talking about? (4, Insightful)

Princeofcups (150855) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644047)

> I have a 500$ emachine that does everything the he/I wants to do. I run windows update on a regular
> basis and have never had a problem. What a whiner. What do i care about different bios versions?

Have you ever tried managing 1000 machines with 1000 average users? Please folks, having a PC at home does not make you an IT specialist. Nor does running linux make you a unix admin.

jfs

Re:what is he talking about? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644123)

Yeah, the Mac lab on campus NEVER gets fucked up. Never underestimate the power of human ignorance. Actually, in my ancedotal evidence there have been more Macs out of the lab for maintenance than the XP boxes.

Re:what is he talking about? (1)

P3NIS_CLEAVER (860022) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644161)

Well my work machine works just as well. I have had a blue screen perhaps twice since windows 2000 came out. They push updates to my machine once a month...

I could waste my time by going through every single point and showing that each problem applies to the mac as well, but I won't.

Re:what is he talking about? (1)

PPGMD (679725) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644203)

Have you ever tried managing 1000 machines with 1000 average users? Please folks, having a PC at home does not make you an IT specialist.

I have it's actually pretty easy with the right tools. Now the tools themselves, are a royal pain in the butt to setup correctly so they run well without any issues.

With the proper security policy, regular updates via SMS, and standarizing the hardware, most help desk calls are limited to people wanting to install Application X, or how do I get Powerpoint to do a swirl like Company X did in their presentation last week.

With roaming profiles desktop machines can be swapped out with ease. Now mobile laptop users are another story.

Re:what is he talking about? (1)

It doesn't come easy (695416) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644051)

Yeah but try doing that on 500 machines. Then, to make matters worse, finding one has to deal with machines set up exactly the same no longer acting the same after an upgrade had been applied...

Welcome to the Bandwagon, Mr. Schwartau! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12643997)

*ahem*
Join the club. [slashdot.org]

SOS (3, Informative)

AshPattern (152048) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644000)

Actually, there was a operating system called Apple SOS. The initial S stood for Sophisticated, though. It ran on the Apple ///.

Apple "SOS". Cute, eh?

WTF? (3, Insightful)

xchino (591175) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644001)

He is upset over the flaws in an Operating System so he switches architectures? He wasn't a PC bigot, he was a Windows bigot.

Re:WTF? (1)

It doesn't come easy (695416) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644086)

These days, PC means Windows of all flavors (at least in the Windows world).

Re:WTF? (1)

Cobralisk (666114) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644129)

Spending is better than mending.

Re:WTF? (1)

cnettel (836611) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644179)

But, read his points! The reason he lists are mostly not security, in fact, but reliability, where he deems the relatively open "PC compatible" space as flawed. Sheesh, I can't even recommend you to RTFA, because of its lack of substance.

Invalid Opinion (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644003)

What I consistently fail to understand is how self-professed experts, in the same breathless exposition of their love for a non-windows OS, can both admit to having suffered the actual symptoms of security problems on Windows and then claim to be an authority.

Yes, there are security problems with windows, but no, you have to be a giant fucktard newbie to actually ever be affected by them. The only problem not requiring gross negligence or browsing the strangest, most dubious .ru/.cn pages was the RPC exploit and if you weren't running a firewall at that point, if for no other reason than preventing ... liberated ... apps phoning home, then there is no excuse.

If you are thinking of replying to this, and you've ever had a virus, spyware, a trojan, your browser hijacked (or been the victim of an exploit not DIRECTLY targeted at you), then please, save yourself the time and don't bother. Your opinion means nothing.

Re:Invalid Opinion (5, Interesting)

grub (11606) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644082)


Yes, there are security problems with windows, but no, you have to be a giant fucktard newbie to actually ever be affected by them.

So not installing a third party firewall, a third party antivirus scanner and third party spyware software makes one a "giant fucktard newbie"? Perhaps you should address why all these third party applications are needed just to give a Wintel box a basic level of security?

Re:Invalid Opinion (1)

telbij (465356) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644109)

If you are thinking of replying to this, and you've ever had a virus, spyware, a trojan, your browser hijacked (or been the victim of an exploit not DIRECTLY targeted at you), then please, save yourself the time and don't bother. Your opinion means nothing.

Oh yeah, because anyone who doesn't spend their free time reading up on the latest windows viruses, updating their firewalls, and tweaking their system is basically ripe for genocide, right?

Just because everyone in high school thought you were worthless doesn't mean the inverse is true. Please grow up and get a life.

Re:Invalid Opinion (2, Interesting)

Princeofcups (150855) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644111)

> What I consistently fail to understand is how self-professed experts, in the same breathless
> exposition of their love for a non-windows OS, can both admit to having suffered the actual symptoms of
> security problems on Windows and then claim to be an authority.
>
> Yes, there are security problems with windows, but no, you have to be a giant fucktard newbie to
> actually ever be affected by them.

So to you 99% of the world are clueless fucktards? Because the number of people who understand how to secure a windows environment are few and far between.

jfs

Re:Invalid Opinion (1)

Perl-Pusher (555592) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644198)

Yes, there are security problems with windows, but no, you have to be a giant fucktard newbie to actually ever be affected by them.

I personally prefer my powerbook and a Linux desktop. I have administered hundreds of windows machines and have 2 windows machines (laptop and a desktop). I have never had problems with security on any of my machines. That said, I have worked in companies that have 50 vice presidents and have had to clean up the crap off their machines. Try telling someone who makes a seven figure salary they can't install whatever the hell they want! They don't have to worry about consequences any problems are my fault. By bringing that powerbook to every meeting, I have slowly over 2 years converted 10 people to powerbooks. They in turn show their peers their new toy! After someone gets a powerbook, they ask questions for about a month. After that, I never have to worry about them again. Unless they drop it!

Good 'switch' argument (4, Funny)

Inigo Soto (776501) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644009)

But now, I've had it. I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore.

Ahhhh... Who doesn't like a cool, balanced opinion?

Re:Good 'switch' argument (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644178)

Actually its the only switch argument. How often do you hear someone say, "You know I really love this product, so I think I'll stop using it."

It is human nature to resist change can corporations rely on this. Once you are using a product the pain threshold is very high for switching to another similar product. How often do you buy the same car, go to the same mechanic, buy the same CPU/GPU not because they are the best there is but because it is what you always buy.

Most of the time customer loyalty isn't loyalty its just lazyness. And the only reason you will change is due to anger.

Immaturity== Slashdot (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644011)

Another /. story so that everyone can have their daily windows bashing fix. At one time /. used to be for people who are interested in science & technology. It has become so immature these days.

Why oh why... (4, Insightful)

kayak334 (798077) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644017)

...must we post a story about every person who thinks that platform X is better than platform Y and is just plain "fed up"? Of course, as long as we include the statement "I used to be a platform X user ONLY, now I'm switching to Y," then it matters a whole lot more.

Re:Why oh why... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644065)

It is like when a Republican thinks a Democrat has a good idea. Suddenly he/she is enlightened and smart.

Re:Why oh why... (2, Insightful)

Princeofcups (150855) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644174)

> ...must we post a story about every person who thinks that platform X is better than platform Y and
> is just plain "fed up"? Of course, as long as we include the statement "I used to be a platform X
> user ONLY, now I'm switching to Y," then it matters a whole lot more.

When 98% of the business world would never dream of switching from windows to mac because of the cost and difficulties, when a company does it successfully and easily, and is happy with the results, it IS news. It's a wake up call to the brainwashed masses.

jfs

Crazy (4, Interesting)

gowen (141411) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644021)

I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore
Just the state of mind in which someone will produce an article that is as reasonable, balanced, fair and articulate as this one.

Some Windows software applications are well written; others take shortcuts. : How is this different from Mac software?

Memory Not all RAM is equal. Some works well. Cheap stuff doesn't. : Makes save you from this trouble by only allowing you to buy the expensive stuff

Hard disks. Same problem: cheap or reliable. Your call. : Again, solved by Apple by not allowing "cheap".

Windows is complex, trying to be everything to everyone. : Have you seen an Apple commercial recently? Or the "switch" ones?

Re:Crazy (1)

MooseByte (751829) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644149)

The article states "because he's fed up with the security issues plaguing Windows-based systems", not that he got fed up with cheap PC components or applications that take shortcuts.

While I find his approach extreme, I can certainly sympathize with his being fed up. Windows "security" has been promised for ages and isn't really forthcoming. So the only alternative is to build a fortress around your network.

And then hope that no user on the network does something stupid. Given enough time, that's unfortunately inevitable as well.

Re:Crazy (1)

gowen (141411) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644196)

The article also enumerates all those other complaints. That's where I copied them from.

What's wrong with corporate system admins? (5, Insightful)

klubar (591384) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644028)

I don't get it. Administering Windows XP in a corporate environment isn't that hard. There is no reason why a company that hires a competent sys admin (or multiple sys admins) cant configure and administer Windows XP so they are nearly virus-free, spyware-free and spam-free. Lock those machines down! Put in a good corporate firewall! Don't allow users to run as admin (never)! Don't allow users to install software, active-x or other junk. Use centrally maintained anti-virus and anti-spam. In a corporate environment there should be a limited list of authorized programs, nothing else should be permitted.

It isn't that hard. The permissions and controls on Windows are extremely fine grained. Learn about them and use them.

I think there are a lot of clueless or bad sys admin who use "everyone knows Windows" is insecure to cover their asses for doing a bad job. The same lousy sys admins could screw up Macs too.

Re:What's wrong with corporate system admins? (3, Informative)

angrist (787928) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644066)

Ever try running Windows as something other than admin?

There are a lot of applications that just won't run.

Re:What's wrong with corporate system admins? (1)

Jeff DeMaagd (2015) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644101)

Very true.

It's actually a lot easier to lock down OS X, and the defaults are better set up. There is no administrator (root) account by default (can be enabled though), and anything needing those defaults to run requires the system password.

Re:What's wrong with corporate system admins? (4, Insightful)

grasshoppa (657393) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644104)

Don't allow users to run as admin (never)!

Easier said then done. A lot of software is designed to only work as admin. One such example I have to deal with is a printer that sends data it captures to a remote server ( electronic claim processing ). Won't run as normal user, security audits to find the exact permissions don't find what's needed to make it work as a normal user. Power user and above. I have three examples where I work, and I know I'm not alone.

The problem isn't windows per se, it's the developers. There's all this bad inertia with the developers, and until MS addresses this, we will continue to see windows wonkiness.

Re:What's wrong with corporate system admins? (2, Insightful)

klubar (591384) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644141)

And does that software run at all on a Mac or under Linux?

Re:What's wrong with corporate system admins? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644115)

Thanks giving everyone a great example of just what a bunch of fucked in the head people like you are out there in the computing world.

MS has created a thousands upon thousands of trained retarted monkeys like this clown who spend their time online parroting out the latest MS PR damage control mantra.

"It's not MS's shitty OS, it's the users fault!"

"All OS'es have massive security problems, ours are only so public because we just so darn popular!"

Do the computing world a favor and walk infront of a bus.

Re:What's wrong with corporate system admins? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644116)

You mean't an XP based firewall?

Re:What's wrong with corporate system admins? (2, Interesting)

grub (11606) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644126)


Administering Windows XP in a corporate environment isn't that hard.

With what ratio of geeks-users? My workplace has a lot of Linux users and a fair amount of Macs. We have 4 full time people for ~300 machines at this site. If we were all Windows we'd need more people.

Re:What's wrong with corporate system admins? (3, Interesting)

Compholio (770966) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644192)

I think there are a lot of clueless or bad sys admin who use "everyone knows Windows" is insecure to cover their asses for doing a bad job.

I used that excuse (and that our server was too overloaded) to switch our mail and VPN to Linux. I also used that excuse to get antivirus software and Mozilla Firefox installed on every machine. Guess what? It works and we have way less problems than we had before. No matter how much you lock Windows down (which is not always an option BTW, you're the employee not the boss) there are still security issues in Windows software that can blow you out of the water.

Re:What's wrong with corporate system admins? (5, Insightful)

finkployd (12902) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644199)

Put in a good corporate firewall!

I love how the standard response from anyone on windows network security is to put the windows machine behind another machine running an OS that does not have the history of massive security problems.

When was the last time you heard of a firewall running (IOS/Linux/BSD/whatever) having an unpatched vulnerability on a network service that (1) you cannot turn off and (2) you cannot tell not to listen on every port?
I of course refer to the RPC endpoint mapper on 135 vulnerability that plagued windows a while ago. Stuff like that is why windows is known as a joke in the security world.

I agree however, that the vast majority of windows problems are caused by clueless admins. However, it is MS's own fault in a sense. A major selling point is that you do not need to understand networking or really much of anything to administer a windows network. This has led to legions of drooling point and click admins who lack even the most basic understand of security and networking principles. Interestingly Mac's are just as easy (if not easier) to admin, BUT they are much more secure by default. Plop a windows box and a Mac in front of a newbie and see which one is "0wned" first.

Finkployd

Maybe he should compete? (2, Funny)

naer_dinsul (784040) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644029)

Maybe we should forward the article straight to Microsoft [slashdot.org] ?

You never know, he might win!

OSS and the straw (1)

mindserfer (209937) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644032)

Security may just be the deciding factor
between OSS and non-OSS, in terms of
Total cost of ownership.

-my $.03 - inflation

my next machine will be a powerbook (1, Interesting)

hsmith (818216) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644035)

i can do all the programming i need on it (even .NET), unix backend, awesome interface. iPod even helped get me in the store to play with them.

Re:my next machine will be a powerbook (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644169)

Great, what does this have to do with the article? It doesn't. You were modded up by the Apple fanboys who saw "I'm switching to a Powerbook" and said "oooh groupthink++!"

We know that the Powerbooks are nice. We knows that OS X is nice. Some of us even run it. That doesn't mean that you should have been modded up for saying it!

Re:my next machine will be a powerbook (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644197)

So will mine. I need a machine that is secure, stable, easy to install software, slick UI, and that it will JUST WORK.

Sorry Windows and Linux. One needs to be secure. Linux, you're almost there, but not quite. Maybe another 10 years.

I'm mad as hell... (0, Redundant)

ReadbackMonkey (92198) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644036)

and I'm not going to take it ANYMORE!

An Idiot Among Millions (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644040)

This story reminds me of my dad and his peecee. It was a constant source of problems and taking it back to the computer shop. All the usual Microsoft virus and spyware nightmares.

He absolutely refused to consider anything else. He was not going to waste all the time he wasted already dealing with his Microsoft OS by switching to something that actually works. All those months and months for nothing. Switching to a non-broken platform would have made him feel like an idiot for wasting all that time.

Whatever dad.

i told ya (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644041)

it was gonna happen, blargh

Commentary (2, Informative)

taskforce (866056) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644062)

Paul Thurrott, Windows Journalist posted a commentary on his blog about this:

http://www.internet-nexus.com/2005_05_22_archive.h tm#111706797008800101 [internet-nexus.com]

He basicly points out that a lot of the things the guy says are not Windows spesific at all, such as RAM, BIOS versions, different hardware etc. It's worth noting that just becuase Apple brands a product identically and doesn't tell you what's in it it doesn't mean it's the same thing (Different mainboards for PowerMac systems etc)

Agreed... (1)

Nijika (525558) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644193)

I don't know why I care, but I have a bad feeling he is actually going to have a better user experience on his new Mac, and then he'll claim that it solved all his problems when all it did was remedy some of them to the point where the others no longer bother him.

I guess my worry is that he'll be evangelizing about the wrong things.

That being said, from the hardware front, when you buy Apple you almost always get much better craftsmanship. Open up any PowerMac tower and you'll be drooling, even if your a PC modder you'll be impressed. And the architecture synchronicity can be a huge breath of fresh air.

Join the club! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644067)

I stopped taking it up the ass from Bill Gates a loooooong time ago.

A testament to OS X's stable nature (5, Informative)

blakespot (213991) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644070)

I've run OS X ony my home Macs for nearly 5 years now. (It was my great experience with NeXTSTEP back in '94 that let me know OS X is the only place I needed to be.) My XP box at work crashes hard or needs to be reset by me several times a month. Leaving it on at a stretch, I sometimes see unexplainable lags in responsiveness. It's a painful contrast.

Something that amuses me is the fact that OS X crashes out so infrequently (about once every 18 months) that when it does happen, I immediately assume I must have a hardware problem. That really is a testament to the solidity of an operating systemthat you might expect the hardware to go before the software crashes. And that's not to say I've had any hardware issues to speak of (outside of dropping an iBook onto a tile floor...)

Windows (and Linux) folks are really missing out, in my somewhat humble opinion. I'm most content with my G5 [blakespot.com] , iBook [blakespot.com] , and new Mac mini [mac.com] .

blakespot

Re:A testament to OS X's stable nature (1)

millennial (830897) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644113)

On the other hand, my XP box at home has an uptime of over 150 days, and only crashes when I try to use an antique TV tuner card. I have literally never had a software-related crash; they're all hardware-related, the kind that bring up the new & improved BSOD.

Switching to Apple (1, Insightful)

a3217055 (768293) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644072)

The Appal has tight control over there hardware. Windows works on everything from "Alienware" ( from Aliens ??) to Ling-Tsing-Tsao Computer System. But the most important question is to ask is why is there such a need for auxillary programs like, Anti-Virus, firewall and spyware blocker. I mean the popularity of windows has caused all these exploits. But how do you know they won't happen under Mac OSX, Linux etc... is it because they are not as popular ? Or is it harder to write spyware/viruses for these systems ? Also I think all modern opertaing systems should come with a firewall, it took Microsoft years to come up with a firewall for their systems. This is unacceptable ..

Mad As Hell (4, Funny)

jetkust (596906) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644074)

I'm mad as hell and i'm not going to RTFA anymore.

my dad always said... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644075)

... that it took 10 times more IT staff to look after windows machines

so there's a lesson to be learned here:

we should all move our offices to India, that'd work!

I hope this guy realizes,... (2, Insightful)

nharmon (97591) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644081)

That cheap memory in a Mac will cause the same problems it does in a "Wintel" PC. Same goes for hard drives.

I suppose the type of work his company does not rely on software thats only available for Windows. Because a lot of us run Windows not because we want to, but because we have to.

Am I the only one who thinks knee-jerk, lets convert 100% right now, shoot first ask questions later, is a bad way to convert from Microsoft to Macs (or Linux, Sun, etc.)?

Screaming is not the answer (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644085)

Screaming Is Not the anSwer. JusT use what you wAnt to use and don't Listen to every Lying damn person saying this is Better or that is better. Between the market hype, the falSified test results and Duplicitous bloggers, it's all a wash anyway. Apple, too, will have it's problems.

And, no, I'm not a script (aside from my DNA, of course.)

Re:Screaming is not the answer (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644121)

ApPle is BSD, or did yoU Not looK?

Hmmm... (1)

graikor (127470) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644089)

I can certainly see that the Mac, especially running the Unix-based System X, would be inherently more stable than a Wintel machine, but it is certainly true that there are viruses and trojans that affect Macintosh, and at least some of the relative paucity of malware on Macintosh is due to its lower market share.

Still, I haven't used a Mac regularly since System 7 was new, so maybe I need to buy a Mac mini and test this out for myself...

Microsoft Ad in the Midst of this (0)

Cyphertube (62291) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644094)

An aside, not totally off-topic.

Context sensitivity for ads on Slashdot are not the best. This ad [osdn.com] for Visual Web Developer 2005 came up as I opened this.

Considering the article is oriented towards ditching Windows in favour of Macs, why advertise a Windows-based development tool?

At any rate, I went from Windows to Linux, so I didn't have to change hardware. I'm happy, and Windows is relegated to a virtual machine for a few games, which, IMHO, is about the security level its worth.

Doesn't make any sense (0, Redundant)

DrXym (126579) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644097)

The Mac is regarded as secure because it takes the same stance to security as modern Unix systems.


Okay the guy sounds pissed, but it doesn't make sense why you'd drop all your hardware at the same time as you'd drop XP. Any PC that can run XP can in all liklihood run Linux (or BSD) and benefit from security goodness too.

Being All Things (5, Insightful)

Spencerian (465343) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644098)

We've heard many of the other comments from disgruntled Windows users before, but one that bears repeating is that Windows does tend to try to be all things to all people. Sure, there's a Home version of Windows XP (it's missing, among other things, domain networking ability), but it still contains far too many propellerhead parts that gunk up the works.

I can't really say that alternatives such as Mac OS X and Linux aren't as full of similar unnecessary parts as Windows. By, IMHO, when using OS X, the extras seem less likely to be in your way. A lot of this involves the interface; a good desktop manager in Linux should keep things similarly simple.

Someone said it when they were using Word for Windows, flummoxed by the myriad of controls: "Good lord, I don't need to launch a Space Shuttle--I just want to write a letter!" No wonder some new computer users have the movie "WarGames" running through their head each time they touch their PC--it's complexity seems to guarantee that something new will happen each time you use it...and not a "good" kind of "new."

Switch to Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644102)

We were negotiating a deal with the pentagon and we had a blue screen of death. That was the last straw. When you're holding the moon for ransom, you value stability in an application. Linux gives us the power we need to crush those who oppose us. It's compatible with our orbiting brain lazers. I have a beowolf cluster of atomic supermen. I have more friends now. Genetically engineered cyber-goats, henchmen with bad teeth... georgous fembots with a penchant for evil. It just changed my love life... ya have to uh... config it, partition your drives, write some shell scripts, patch your kernel and update your version dependencies. Uh... better do that once or twice. It's just _SO_ easy, I just don't understand why everyone doesn't run Linux. Thank God they don't, or they'd all be super villians. I'm Steve... and I'm a super villian.

Hmm... (5, Insightful)

Bones3D_mac (324952) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644105)

I love the mac about as much as the next guy, but do we really need these "x switches to Mac" threads posted on a daily basis? This practically begs to reduce slashdot to just another forum for mac vs pc flame wars.

I'd like to think we're past that stage.

Ok... (3, Insightful)

crazzeto (887234) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644107)

You know, not that I'm saying windows is the best platform in the world... But considering the issues he outlined in this artical, I'd say he is dealing with the wrong vendor for his computing solutions... With a good vendor (Dell, HPaq...) you will get the same level of hardware/software compatibility you will find on a Mac platform. The author also isn't doing a good job of choosing software. Basically, it seems to me his basic problem is going research finding good hardware/software solutions. I bet he'll have many of the same problems on the Mac platform.

I feel the same way (1)

apathyonline (886926) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644108)

Thats great. I feel the same way. Windows XP is too slow on it (700mhz) and I can't get all the hardware running with Linux. I want something that just works -- I'll probably choose a mac next time. Its funny though, never thought someone would be that angry about it

Why?? (0, Redundant)

The Woodworker (723841) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644112)

This just doesn't make sense. Why would you switch to the Mac right now as their hardware has obvious problems. Take, for example, their powerbooks. Slim, great quality screen, lightweight, and there are even rumors that all the pixels work out of the box! Why, Apple, WHY!

And those G5 machines. 64 bits and quite as can be. Optical audio jacks. Why not give out pirate CDs with those things. And what is that key on the keyboard? It looks like a little apple. Do I eat it? They're just too strange and confusing to effectively use.

-5 for obvious sarcasm and flame!

The reasons for switching will be more complex ... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644114)

..and more than just 'i can't stand viruses/spamware/spyware' anymore. The Apple computing platform has to actually offer something more and better than Windows in the long term.

Currently, apart from a subjectively prettier GUI and case and lack of malware I'm not convinced it actually does.

Then you have the grave difference in hardware costs between the platforms and the far bigger software library on Wintel. Also games and 3d graphics in particular tend to perform much much better on Windows PC and you have to ask is it worth it ?

Personally as a die hard Mac user for many years I'm not sure it is anymore and have a strong feeling my next machine might actually be a Windows box.

This guy claims to be a security expert (2, Insightful)

PPGMD (679725) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644128)

With 22 years in the industry as a so called expert you would think he would know the simple steps needed to secure a Windows machine. It's not that hard, even with staying with IE.

Step 1: Avoid Fishy Sites.
This is 90% of the problem people assume that the internet is safe, and routinely surf the web, allow ActiveX controls to run unfettered, install Gator because it allows them to remember all their passwords. The internet is not a safe place, whether you are on a Windows, Mac, or Linux. It is a safe place for BSD users, because BSD is dead, so no one writes anything for it. :)

Step 2: Get updates every couple of months
Windows update, and apt-get make this process easier. Even Linux when it's not updated can get compromised (though not as easily nor as quickly as Windows).

Step 3: Use a Firewall of some sort.
99% of exploits require direct access to the machine, even the most basic firewall will prevent that access.

These are very basic tips that I think even Joe Blow on the street can learn if he is willing to listen. Sometimes that listening takes 2-3 times of his machine getting compromised and reloaded at $105 a pop.

This is perfect for me... (1)

Osrin (599427) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644136)

... in line with the article, this is my first post from my mac, it arrived yesterday, originally ordered with much of the same sentiment that is found in the article.

24 hours later I'm extatic about the purchase. Lets see what the next 24 moths hold.

I was fed up with both Windows and Mac! (1)

ylikone (589264) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644144)

Which is why I switched all my computers to Linux 5 years ago. Not looking back.

STOP obeying popups. (1)

LupidStupy (663804) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644147)

99% of the problems my users have come from Comet, gator, Realplayer, pop ups telling my users that if they want to view content on a page that have to click yes, using Flash, going to sites that their friend sent in an email to see something funny, clicking on the .scr that they received after opening the zip file, AOL taking over their browser, Yahoo taking over their browser, Comcast taking over their browser, old computers running 98 with no updates with file sharing turned on and their mouse moving by itself sometimes, etc.

Why do Programs need to start when windows start.

I am a windows user and I have made various amounts of money correcting users PCs but I am feeling more and more like this guy every day and I am feeling the need to switch.

Dumb (1)

endus (698588) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644153)

"Windows is complex, trying to be everything to everyone. This complexity comes at a terrible price: downtime, help desks, upgrades, patches and the inevitable failures."

So he doesn't think a large Mac deployment is going to require a helpdesk? What an idiot. Does he not think that the UNIX backend to OS X is complex? I personally don't find windows to be particularly complex, and certainly is nowhere near as complex to run as other OSes I have dealt with. There is certain baseline maintinance you have to do with windows, and precautions you have to take, and when you do that everything is fine. I haven't rebooted my work PC (XP) for weeks (months??) now and I don't get spyware. That's because I a.) Don't surf porn and pirate music at work, I let firefox block popups, and I run a decent AV program. I have anti-spyware programs installed, but rarely use them.

"When a new operating system or service pack is released, there are tons of changes to the functionality."

Uhhh...no, there's really not. Windows hasn't done anything revolutionary since Windows 95. My company only somewhat recently went from 95 to 2k (tens of thousands of machines) and the users really didn't have many problems with adjusting. Does he not think there are significant differences between OS X and System 9? Dumb.

"WinTel machines use different versions of BIOS. They are not all equal, nor do they all have the same level of compatibility."

Never had a problem.

"Some Windows software applications are well written; others take shortcuts. Shortcuts may work in some environments, but not all, and ultimately the consumer pays in lost time, availability and productivity."

Of all his "points" this is the dumbest one. He's blaming Windows for the work of app vendors. HA! I work in QA/App deployment so BELIEVE me I know how bad app vendors are, but that's not windows' problem.

I guess no one has mentioned the bug in Adobe's software under OS X that was causing it to take approximately 10 minutes to task between Illustrator and Photoshop.

"Hardware. There are hundreds of "WinTel-compatible" motherboards, each claiming to be better than the next. Whatever."

This is bad....why again? Here's a simple solution: buy ASUS.

"Memory. Not all RAM is equal. Some works well. Cheap stuff doesn't."

So don't buy the cheap stuff.

"Hard disks. Same problem: cheap or reliable. Your call. "

Never had a problem. Western Dig drives have been extremely reliable for me.

Listen, I'm no big fan of Windows, but these critisisms are just stupid and make no sense.

What's frustrating about this stuff is that 99% of these "no windows" rants that make it to slashdot are obviously due to incompetance on the part of the people maintaining the user's PC's. Yes, Windows certainly has it's gremlins, just like any OS, and you have to set your infrastructure up to deal with those gremlins. Is Windows the best OS for every application? Certainly not, but lobbing critisisms which are simply not that well thought out at it and then expecting OS X to wash your car and eliminate blackheads isn't going to help anyone.

Who and Where? (3, Funny)

Kainaw (676073) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644159)

Who is this Winn Schwartau guy and what company is he talking about. He says he is in "security", so we better take his word for it when he says Windows is insecure and Mac isn't. His reasons (for those who don't want to RTFA). (my comments are inline)
  • Windows is complex (and Mac is as simple as my old TI-99 4/A?)
  • New package releases have tons of changes to functionality (yes, with SP2 you suddenly had to use the mouse on the left side of the keyboard or it wouldn't point correctly!)
  • WinTel machines use different versions of BIOS (Hmmm... I never realized that Windows absorbed and used my BIOS. That must be why I suck at Doom 3 - I need a better BIOS)
  • Some Windows programs take shortcuts (and there are no poorly written Mac programs - none at all. IE5 on Mac displays the web it was meant to be. All other web browsers are broken.)
  • Hardware - there is competition in the motherboard market (and we Mac fans despise competition. All motherboards must be assimilated. Resistance is futile!)
  • RAM - cheap RAM is, well, cheap (especially when you buy it from that guy under the Interstate overpass. I used to be up to 4 sticks a day - that is until the intervention...)
  • Hard drisks - cheap drives are, well, cheap (I'm glad I had the intervention before I got into the hard stuff. Don't let anyone fool you. RAM is just a gateway device. Mess with cheap RAM and you'll be spinning up the cheap Hard Drives before you know it.)

Damn... I forgot to turn on sarcasm mode so the overly serious /. idiots would know this is all just a joke...

That's Right (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644160)

That's right! They're gonna try and take our Windows away! And I, for one, am mad as hell!

*Everyone* Me too!

I'm sick of having my mental condition come into question!

So now, what are we gonna do about it?

Do about what?

They're gonna take our PCs away.

They are?? They can't do that!

That's right. So you know what I think we
should do? I think we should have a windows
users ' meeting! Get all the windows users
together at the community center and unite!

Great idea, Marvin!

Wait, ah I think we're having that meeting right now. ...Oh, right, this is the meeting.

Right. To get those damn Mozilla users
to stop hitting on our websites!

Yeah! Yeah! That's right! Someone's gotta stop them! ...Sharon, have you seen Dad?
He's not here, hun. He's having a meeting with all the Windows users in town at the community center.

Oh. [steps back out] Wait a minute. If all the windows users in town are at a meeting, that means that when the meeting gets out...

Every senior in town will be getting home and
turning on their PC... Oh My God!

Get off the net! Get off the net! Windows users' meeting getting out! Get off the net! [everyone closes their e-mail boxes in full blown panic]

*Suddenly, everyone's mail is deluged with
Spam from millions of Windows viruses noone
yet knew existed...

He's got what he paid for (1)

Petersson (636253) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644164)

Only a fool (or a loony) can expect for high-end performance from low-end software running on low-end hardware.

Full Circle (1)

cluge (114877) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644170)

This is a suprise to us how?

But I digress...

In the "bad old days" one had a terminal, and the main frame did the work. It had inherent advantages (centralization, easy enforcment of security in one place, etc) and disadvantages (When it went down, we all fell down). Then came the PC, and we all got a PC on our desk. It was nirvana the pundits said. Then we needed to communicate with on another. So we started building bridges between the islands of PCs, and then we started adding servers and then came the internet and the web browser and the always on 24/7 never stop (take a breath here) INTERNET economy. WHEW. Now look at the mess we're in.

Solution: Pick the best application for the job at hand.

1. Thin clients and web based apps for a majority of users. Don't install whats not needed.

2. No machine to machine sharing, you need something get it from the web portal.

3. Mix machines/OS/Installs based on the workers needs and requirements. Free ipod is not a business requirement.

Where does all this lead?

If you don't design your network, and train your employees, you OS choice doesn't matter. Windows has many inherent problems, but Mac can inherent some of those problems simply by becoming popular. Until we move away from the PC that "does it all" for the business user, and start looking at smart ways to LIMIT what a PC can and should do - the OS choice is a mute point, albeit it's a step in the right direction by selecting something that is more secure out of the box and works. It's also certainly valid to point out that it's easier to strip down a mac/linux/bsd install to bare minimums. Windows lite is still windows with holes big enough to "drive my hummer through" (as arnold said)

In the end take the best of the bad old mainframe days, and the good things about the PC ideal and put them together. Mac OSX is way more amendable to that concept by it's very nature.

cluge

PEBKAC (1)

KarrottoP (459750) | more than 9 years ago | (#12644195)

I whole heartedly agree that the mac is a better platform on many levels, however my Windows XP / RedHat Linux Domain Controller based network runs fine, the security holes are at least manageable. (I mandated T-Bird and Firefox on all user accounts) Being that we use AutoCAD Mac's aren't a good choice for us, however if managed correctly your windows network doesn't need to be such a menace.

News Flash!!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12644202)

Apple uses the same cheap RAM and Hard drives as other manufacturers do in PCs.
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